SGU Episode 388
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| SGU Episode 388 |
|---|
| 22nd Dec 2012 |
 |
| (brief caption for the episode icon) |
| Skeptical Rogues |
| S: Steven Novella |
B: Bob Novella |
R: Rebecca Watson |
E: Evan Bernstein |
| Quote of the Week |
There is not to be found, in all history, any miracle attested by a sufficient number of men, of such unquestioned good sense, education and learning, as to secure us against all delusion in themselves. |
| Links |
| Download Podcast |
| SGU Podcast archive |
| Forum Discussion |
Introduction
You're listening to the Skeptics' Guide to the Universe, your escape to reality.
S: Hello and welcome to the Skeptics' Guide to the Universe. Today is Monday, December 17, 2012, and this is your host Steven Novella. Joining me this week are Bob Novella,
B: Hey, everybody.
S: Rebecca Watson,
R: Hello, everyone.
S: and Evan Bernstein.
E: So this is what the afterlife is like. Looks a lot like real life.
B: Oh, yeah, that's right. (he laughs)
E: December 22nd!
B: I forgot I was dead. Cool.
S: Yeah, right.
E: When you're listening to this.
R: Well, yeah, I mean, but we don't know, because we are recording this beforehand, so who knows?
E: I am therefore putting down my chit right now, placing my bet. Here we are. December 22nd.
B: I'm gonna hedge my bets. To the aliens that find this as they examine the dead husk of the Earth: Wha'sup? Send more Chuck Berry! (Laughter)
S: Jay is in the process of moving, so he's not available tonight.
R: So sad. I mean, happy for him, but sad for humanity that we have to go without. (Laughter)
E: How will we manage?
S: For one week.
This Day in Skepticism (1:05)
- December 22, 1938: Coelacanth Discovered
R: Hey, happy Coelacanth Day, everybody!
B: Yay!
S: Happy Coelacanth Day, Rebecca.
E: Coelacanth Day.
B: I love coelacanths!
R: On this date in 1938, the coelacanth was rediscovered. It was a primitive fish that was thought to be extinct, and it was discovered by a trawler. Well, I should say, it had probably been seen quite often by people near this South African town where it was eventually quote unquote found. But it was re-found by somebody who knew exactly what they were looking at.
S: Right.
R: In 1938. Quite remarkably, in a trash pile of fish.
E: Jeez.
R: So what happened was, Hendrick Goosen was the captain of a trawler, who would occasionally call upon a local museum curator named Majorie Courtenay-Latimer, at a nearby museum, whenever he found a fish or anything that he thought was kind of weird, because she would be able to identify it and appreciate it. So he called her over to see his catch, but the actual specimen that he wanted to show her apparently wasn't very interesting. But she did look over into his trash pile, and spot the coelacanth, which is, it's not hard to see, when you see the coelacanth, it's not hard to see why the average person would probably not think much of it. It's sort of ugly. It's a dumb-looking fish. There.
S: It's a fish.
R: There's just nothing really interesting about it.
B: It definitely looks odd, though.
E: It's got a big dorsal section.
R: Yeah, I guess so, but it just sort of looks like a fish. Just a fish. But, it turns out that this fish was quite famous because it had been thought extinct, up until that point. So now there are two species, I guess, two species of
S: Yeah, two species.
R: of coelacanth. Both of which are threatened. The West Indian Ocean is critically endangered, still. But, it's kinda cool because it's a living fossil, as they say. It's like dinofish. Because it evolved into its current form about four hundred million years ago.
S: Yeah, but to be clear, 'cause you know how creationists love to play with that "living fossil, evolution is not true."
E: Oh, yeah.
S: This is not the same species that was alive that long ago. This is part of the same family, that family has existed, with little change. But still, this species has not been around for that long. The two species that are around today.
B: But, Steve, it says that it's evolved, I'll quote Wikipedia, "evolved into roughly its current form four hundred million years ago." So it hasn't changed much for four hundred million years.
S: Yeah, but they're talking about the family. Not the species.
R: It's an order. It's an order, not
S: Oh, is it an order?
R: Yeah.
S: Oh, good, cool. Did you know that it has eight fins? Two dorsal, two pectoral, two pelvic, one caudal and one anal.
B: Caudal, ooooh. Oooooh, nice.
R: Anal!
S: It's an anal fin.
R: I can see how that could be handy.
B: So I'm not the only one.
R: Ew.
E: Multi-purpose back there?
B: That is the oddest thing about it, though. It's really
R: About your anal fin?
B: No, not about that. There's more things than that. I'm talking about the coelacanth. It looks very odd with all these fins, sticking out everywhere. Did you know it's more closely related to reptiles than mammals, than to the common ray-finned fishes?
R: I didn't know that.
E: I didn't know that.
B: That's kind of striking.
S: Yeah, it's related to tetrapods and lungfish.
B: Lungfish.
S: It seems odd that that group of fish that are closely related to tetrapods, to vertebrates that walk out on land, are more closely related to creatures on land than they are to other fish, 'cause they're past that branch point that led to land-based vertebrates. You know?
B: Yeah, yeah.
S: Because everything else kept evolving, too. You know what I mean? It's just, a little bit, it's counterintuitive at first, but when you look at the branching tree then it makes perfect sense.
E: So this is kind of a fish out of time in a sense.
S: It's just a remarkably stable order. It's like sharks have been around for a long time. Not the exact same sharks we have today, but sharks as a group, they have been around for a long time, same thing.
R: But of course, Disney still has the right to option fish out of time. (Laughter)
S: Fish out of time.
B: Oh my god. Hey, I didn't know this. The West Indian Ocean coelacanth is a critically endangered species. That kind of sucks. I mean, don't they live so deep. I mean, are they just getting, I guess they're getting . . .
E: That's amazing.
B: . . . picked up all the time. Or maybe their environment's changing, which I doubt. But that's pretty, that would stink if it lasted this long, and just said, "Ahhhh, I'm done."
E: Right? An order, a class for four hundred million years, and then, what? Humans come along and kind of mess things up in a few hundred years, and that's that. Assuming that that's why it's on the critically endangered species list. I don't know that for sure.
News Items
Sandy Hook Massacre (6:00)
China Stabbing (24:22)
AVN To Change Name (27:56)
Megalapteryx Foot (30:44)
Invisibility Cloak (38:03)
Special Report - The Hobbit and High Frame Rate (48:19)
Who's That Noisy? (57:07)
- Last Week's Puzzle: There are three boxes. One is labeled "CARROTS" another is labeled "CELERY". The last one is labeled "CARROTS AND CELERY". You know that each is labeled incorrectly. You may ask me to pick one vegetable from one box which you choose. How can you label the boxes correctly?
Science or Fiction (1:00:35)
Item number one: New research indicates that Alzheimer's disease may be a prion disease similar to mad cow disease. Item number two: Scientists have created a new form of DNA based upon 8 nucleic acids, rather than 4, with potential applications in DNA computing. And item number three: A new study finds that the ovaries of adult women contain stem cells that are able to generate new oocytes right up to menopause.
Skeptical Quote of the Week (1:14:19)
There is not to be found, in all history, any miracle attested by a sufficient number of men, of such unquestioned good sense, education and learning, as to secure us against all delusion in themselves.
David Hume
References
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